The most important thing to do when opening an article about how good of a writer you are, having written one game that was pretty okay 11 years ago, is to drag the writing of a widely beloved game because it has emotional pacing.
Buddy I think you aren’t getting recognized because you are a mid writer.
RagnarokCross
I’ve honestly never heard of any of the games he’s written for, except 80 days and I play a lot of fucking games.The shot at Disco Elysium is completely unnecessary, but at least he acknowledged he’s in the minority.
Entire_Proposal_1318
Hrm… I’ve never heard of heaven’s vault but I sure as hell loved disco Elysium…
Opening your article by describing disco Elysium’s writing as just “fine” seems very dishonest… That game was acclaimed for its very original and stylised narration.
Mysterious-Theory713
Dude just comes across as jealous/salty. He did good writing for some lesser known games but neither game is anywhere near a landmark title.
distortionisgod
I don’t understand people like this. There is plenty of entertainment media that gets released to critical and fan acclaim and I don’t see the big fuss.
But most of the time it’s not because it’s actually bad or just “fine”, it’s just because it’s not suited to my tastes. So I don’t engage with it and move onto one of the many things that is. You don’t need to lament that things are actually bad, just that you have particular tastes and preferences and not everything out there lives up to it.
Looking into his stuff it is most definitely not up my alley. Does that mean it’s mediocre or something? I wouldn’t say that, just not for me. This dude just gives off the air of smelling his own farts and claiming it’s amazing lol.
Necrowaif
Seems like a bit of a wanker.
Wooshio
Just use AI, I bet the stories it could come up will be way more creative than people who end up writing video games stories do. Gaming industry is just not very prestigious as far as writing goes, so it ends up with people who couldn’t cut it as television, movie or classical writers.
willrsauls
I definitely think that when judging video game writing, we’re working off a weird scale. I would definitely argue that the standard for video game stories is lower overall compared to other mediums. I think it comes from a combination of both video game writers tending to recreate tropes from movies without a lot of the depth that makes those moments work as well as the legitimately difficult task of writing a story that works in the context of a game, and the kind of game you’re trying to make. It’s also true that a great gameplay experience can uplift an otherwise mediocre story.
That isn’t to say great video game writing doesn’t exist. Disco Elysium exists. Fallout: New Vegas exists. The Nier games exist. There are games that manage to create interesting, unique stories with difficult, complex themes. It just doesn’t come around as often and feels like a goddamn miracle when it does.
I also don’t want this comment to come off like I’m shitting on video game writers. Shit’s fucking hard to do and it’s important to remember that relatively speaking, video games are a young medium of art and storytelling. I certainly couldn’t do it. I also want to agree with the crowd that Jon Ingold comes off as a pretentious piece of shit in this article.
Brian2005l
This is interesting, but also
“Ingold’s favorite writer is Gene Wolfe . . .” who he describes as “. . . clear . . . .”
He also thinks sci-fi was “rubbish” before Le Guin.
His conclusion is hard to argue, but some of his criticism is very personal. Does make me want to try his games. Game writing absolutely needs opinionated snobs with idiosyncratic but good taste.
GromByzlnyk
The first few paragraphs are filled with so many pretentious quotes that I didn’t care to continue reading. Tastes are so varied that a game with amazing writing might not reach a large portion of gamers because they just don’t like the style of game.
The largest instance I’ve seen recently is the discourse around GTA6. I love GTA and think the writing and satire and gameplay has been consistently great since Vice City. GTA is one of the biggest franchises in gaming and there are loads of people who don’t care for that style of game or writing or humor or hate the mtx online or only play online and never get into the story.
It’s okay to like what you like and discard the rest without shitting all over it as if you are the authority. Have fun and enjoy things that make you happy.
stockinheritance
I mostly agree with him that the bulk of video game writing is subpar but Disco Elysium is the exception and it’s super stupid for him to drag that game.
Really, though, I gravitate towards games where I’m not handed a story. RimWorld is one of my favorite games because the stories arise organically and are unique each playthrough. That’s the strength of the medium: emergent narratives instead of scripted ones.
Chris_P_Lettuce
I agree with what he’s saying but disco Elysium was the wrong game to use. He should have used avowed or neon white as examples of bad writing. Maybe dragon age veilguard.
BbyJ39
Video game writing is generally bad and a good example of that is Bethesda and Starfield. Some of the most lazy and unimaginative slop I’ve ever seen. Especially the MSQ which should be the highlight not the low point.
That dude Emil’s whole philosophy on games writing is shitty. Anyway, I’m glad this is being brought up and think we need to talk about it more so devs do better.
zimzalllabim
No thanks, I’d rather have the 20 mins of someone describing breathing.
Vergilx217
A caption for a photo in the article:
“After Ingold struggled to name examples of good video game writing, he mentioned The Last Express, an adventure game that was released in 1997.”
Yeah I think the journalist is definitely taking the piss out of this guy.
16 Comments
[deleted]
The most important thing to do when opening an article about how good of a writer you are, having written one game that was pretty okay 11 years ago, is to drag the writing of a widely beloved game because it has emotional pacing.
Buddy I think you aren’t getting recognized because you are a mid writer.
I’ve honestly never heard of any of the games he’s written for, except 80 days and I play a lot of fucking games.The shot at Disco Elysium is completely unnecessary, but at least he acknowledged he’s in the minority.
Hrm… I’ve never heard of heaven’s vault but I sure as hell loved disco Elysium…
Opening your article by describing disco Elysium’s writing as just “fine” seems very dishonest… That game was acclaimed for its very original and stylised narration.
Dude just comes across as jealous/salty. He did good writing for some lesser known games but neither game is anywhere near a landmark title.
I don’t understand people like this. There is plenty of entertainment media that gets released to critical and fan acclaim and I don’t see the big fuss.
But most of the time it’s not because it’s actually bad or just “fine”, it’s just because it’s not suited to my tastes. So I don’t engage with it and move onto one of the many things that is. You don’t need to lament that things are actually bad, just that you have particular tastes and preferences and not everything out there lives up to it.
Looking into his stuff it is most definitely not up my alley. Does that mean it’s mediocre or something? I wouldn’t say that, just not for me. This dude just gives off the air of smelling his own farts and claiming it’s amazing lol.
Seems like a bit of a wanker.
Just use AI, I bet the stories it could come up will be way more creative than people who end up writing video games stories do. Gaming industry is just not very prestigious as far as writing goes, so it ends up with people who couldn’t cut it as television, movie or classical writers.
I definitely think that when judging video game writing, we’re working off a weird scale. I would definitely argue that the standard for video game stories is lower overall compared to other mediums. I think it comes from a combination of both video game writers tending to recreate tropes from movies without a lot of the depth that makes those moments work as well as the legitimately difficult task of writing a story that works in the context of a game, and the kind of game you’re trying to make. It’s also true that a great gameplay experience can uplift an otherwise mediocre story.
That isn’t to say great video game writing doesn’t exist. Disco Elysium exists. Fallout: New Vegas exists. The Nier games exist. There are games that manage to create interesting, unique stories with difficult, complex themes. It just doesn’t come around as often and feels like a goddamn miracle when it does.
I also don’t want this comment to come off like I’m shitting on video game writers. Shit’s fucking hard to do and it’s important to remember that relatively speaking, video games are a young medium of art and storytelling. I certainly couldn’t do it. I also want to agree with the crowd that Jon Ingold comes off as a pretentious piece of shit in this article.
This is interesting, but also
“Ingold’s favorite writer is Gene Wolfe . . .” who he describes as “. . . clear . . . .”
He also thinks sci-fi was “rubbish” before Le Guin.
His conclusion is hard to argue, but some of his criticism is very personal. Does make me want to try his games. Game writing absolutely needs opinionated snobs with idiosyncratic but good taste.
The first few paragraphs are filled with so many pretentious quotes that I didn’t care to continue reading. Tastes are so varied that a game with amazing writing might not reach a large portion of gamers because they just don’t like the style of game.
The largest instance I’ve seen recently is the discourse around GTA6. I love GTA and think the writing and satire and gameplay has been consistently great since Vice City. GTA is one of the biggest franchises in gaming and there are loads of people who don’t care for that style of game or writing or humor or hate the mtx online or only play online and never get into the story.
It’s okay to like what you like and discard the rest without shitting all over it as if you are the authority. Have fun and enjoy things that make you happy.
I mostly agree with him that the bulk of video game writing is subpar but Disco Elysium is the exception and it’s super stupid for him to drag that game.
Really, though, I gravitate towards games where I’m not handed a story. RimWorld is one of my favorite games because the stories arise organically and are unique each playthrough. That’s the strength of the medium: emergent narratives instead of scripted ones.
I agree with what he’s saying but disco Elysium was the wrong game to use. He should have used avowed or neon white as examples of bad writing. Maybe dragon age veilguard.
Video game writing is generally bad and a good example of that is Bethesda and Starfield. Some of the most lazy and unimaginative slop I’ve ever seen. Especially the MSQ which should be the highlight not the low point.
That dude Emil’s whole philosophy on games writing is shitty. Anyway, I’m glad this is being brought up and think we need to talk about it more so devs do better.
No thanks, I’d rather have the 20 mins of someone describing breathing.
A caption for a photo in the article:
“After Ingold struggled to name examples of good video game writing, he mentioned The Last Express, an adventure game that was released in 1997.”
Yeah I think the journalist is definitely taking the piss out of this guy.