When it comes to loyalty, who do you think is the most loyal ? (I saw so many similarities between Takemura and Solomon)
When it comes to loyalty, who do you think is the most loyal ? (I saw so many similarities between Takemura and Solomon)
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Both. Even after they been betrayed they still are loyal and will give their life for the people that betrayed them.
id say takemura. reed actually has regrets if you >!choose his path and end up mercy killing so mi!<
I gotta say.. I want a buddy cop duo starring Takemura and Reed.
Who most loyal?
The one in the middle.
Takemura. Reed doesn’t seem particularly annoyed the NUSA leaves him alone for 7 years. Goro on the other hand wants to always be involved in what the Arasakas are doing.
Anyone else absolutely hates Reed? I can’t find a good side to that character he’s just a lying government pawn.
Reed spends 7 years lying dormant in Dogtown of all places just waiting for orders from Myers, even after she tried to have him killed. I’d say he’s shown more loyalty from that alone.
reed is the most loyal.
Takemura immediately tries to betray the head of Arasaka. Sure it’s FOR another Arasaka but Reed wouldn’t only follow myers. he’d follow another NUSA president the same way.
Loyalty? More like Stockholm Syndrome. The making of a cult, both institutions equally stripped them of their sense of self, indoctrinated and had replaced it with hypocritical ideologies. I’m actually glad you posted this, when Johnny said in Phantom Liberty how Reed reminded him of himself , and that’s what he would have become had he stayed in the army…. I immediately thought of Takemaru and Reed being mirror reflections both in service to “masters” willing to risk one and all to reach their ambitions. Songbird parallels with Yorinobus a bit as well
First question is: who Solomon is loyal to? As a patriot to NUSA or people he works on as a soldier, when serving is his honor no matter what, no matter who.
Arasaka is a concept within itself. Whether it have some “inner complex philosophy” or how much Goro is idealizing it as the entity that on one hand takes opportunities from ones and gives them to another other ones (his way of justifying the existence of Arasaka and Corp in general) – subjectively I see this situation as Goro got much less “life” and “principles” left beyond Arasaka than Solomon beyond Myers or current authority or FIA agency.
On the other hand, if Solomon is devoted to NUSA itself, the principles of strong government and OG-times when USA worked as the concept of order and **working** regulator of social affairs, economy and life quality that eventually was times more efficient from order perspective than current 2077 reality – I think it might be even stronger, than Goro’s devotion to Arasaka. Once ‘Saka changes it direction and one of the “wrong” birds take over the corp and even get rid of OG-moths – I really doubt in worst case scenario Goro won’t follow his “very unlikely to happen Nomad scenario” he mentioned. Because there’s nothing left to serve, except for the name?
Yet the concept of NUSA is kind of more infinite for Reed.
Takemura
Even when betrayed and targeted his first thought was to do what was best for Arasaka while also being loyal to those who helped him (V).
15 states left in the Union. Who are the states? I imagine DC has been redifined as a state and the similarities to the Puerto Rican flag makes me think Puerto Rico is somehow important.
Reed imo. Dude knows what’s he’s doing is wrong and still does it; at least Takemura is deluded enough to think he’s on the good side.
Takemura is only loyal to Arasaka and never gives a shit about V. Reed at least actually cares about V in the end and overall doesn’t fuck us over.
Reed. Takemura has loyalty to Arasaka but only the parts that actually support him and his worldview and is quick to turn on those who he thinks betrayed that.
Reed literally gets stabbed in the back by the NUSA several times and crawls back like a kicked dog. The entire story I was waiting for the moment where Reed revealed that he’s tricking V and has been trying to take on the NUSA in revenge and when it never came I was actively confused about it.
heh, they both got killed in my 2.0 playthough…
however, Reed I would think, he had 7 years of downtime and then picked it right back up when his owner calls can lays bodies anywhere it suits him.
Takemura went from one owner to another within the week with no time to think about it besides using a random merc he found who saw the murder which fits his ideals of revenge.
both pets go running when called by their owners but one had lots of time to stop, think and sort out a life like alex but he just went back like no time had passed
Good people, bad allegiances
always did hurt to see Goro on the post credits after saving him just cursing me
They both have nice jackets, I can’t choose.
Takemura is far more loyal. Even after all that time after Saburo was murdered, he uncovered the truth and exposed Yorinobu. Reed was only loyal to himself. He was willing to let Songbird become a digital slave to Meyers just so he could say “well I saved her life I’m a good person!”
Sorry but you’ll never convince me being turned into an engram against your will is a loyal move.
Man I **REALLY** want those leather coats as playable apparel items… Reed’s reminds me of Maxon’s Battle Coat from Fallout 4 and Takemura’s just gives off this cyberpunk punisher vibe I really love.
I don’t know, but I love their jackets and would want both of them… in real life.
Reed is loyal to the ideals of the NUSA but recognizes its flaws. He also fucking hates Myers and makes that abundantly clear.
Takemura however is devoutly loyal to Arasaka, he excuses everything they do and see’s nothing wrong with it as well as worships Saburo despite the man being the literal devil of the Cyberpunk world.
The two just aren’t comparable. While both are loyal, only one is loyal to a fault and will excuse every one of their actions.
I would say Takemura. He is as loyal as a dog. No matter what happens or what you do, he is unwaveringly loyal to Arasaka. He cares little for his life before Arasaka and scorns it. He cares little for you saving his life or doing things for him. He would burn that bridge instantly, and shows no reluctance doing it.
Reed would reluctantly betray friends for NUSA. He isn’t blindly loyal, but he is loyal to a fault. He is nowhere near as machine like and unfeeling as Takemura is.
Honestly? It’s rather subjective.
Takemura is a samurai—he’ll live and die as Saburo Arasaka’s bodyguard. But Reed will self-compromise his own beliefs and morals if it meant the NUSA benefits.
Takemura would not raise a hand against Arasaka, but Reed would kill Myers if it means NUSA thrives. Which shows more loyalty??
Takemura was given an education, military training and luxuries. Reed was betrayed by the people he believed in with his figurative surrogate daughter as the one who pulled the trigger. Takemura knew his end goals and had his own code of honour. Even if he can’t comprehend the ramifications of Soulkiller and Saburos ideologies.
Reed has betrayed everybody he knew with surface level justifications for doing so. At least So Mi just wanted to be free, lying and betraying others was simply all she knew. Same for Alex as she simply believes her ends justify her means. Reed betrayed himself by bringing his agents down to the same level as him while constantly talking about responsibility and claiming he knows what’s best for everyone. He’s a victim of the FIA thought-machine as well to the point he’ll always answer and never question.
I think the definition of loyalty here is questionable.
I think on the one hand, they’re both equally loyal, but they’re loyal in different ways to different things. But their loyalty is also mixed with lots of other conflicting things.
Goro is blindly loyal to the idea of Arasaka, to what he holds to be its potential and the positives he has gained from it as well as what he sees as positive for the world “wrong and blind”.
Reed is loyal, but not blind. Loyal to the leadership of a country he hopes will still be there. Loyal to the team, to the people, to the cause. But like Johnny says, those in power will bring out the “values” card when the other carrots have stopped working. So in a lot of ways Reed is delusional in his devotion. Those values aren’t real.
Plus, they’re desperate for different things. What they may “want” is to be back in the fold, but what they need are different. Goro openly admit what he really needs is revenge against Yorinobu. Reed needs to square things with his team. His needs a bit more cloudy.
Personally, I think Goro can go eat a dick. He doesn’t even countenance the possibility that Arasaka may be the villain. Reed at least is very aware that there are no saints on the board, they’re all pawns.